[MUD-Dev] Fear of magic (was:Usability and interface)

[Sauron]

> I don't know about coding things but it can't be so hard to have a
realistic
> way to arrest people. It happens all the time of course? You just need some
> way for your police to restrain people. Things like shackles and handcuffs?

coding is how you program the game to do whatever you want to do. i
really think it would be very inefficient to have to have a guard hold
and restrain a person, apply handcuffs and take them away. my belief is
that have the guards be set a high lvl (assuming that you are using
levels), have them fight using the ic combat system (so that you can
possibly defeat one, but not a whole mob), have some way to restrain the
mage from escaping during this combat (ie hold person or have them
"surrounded"), and when they "die", instead of being killed are
teleported to the dungeon w/ and explanation like "the guards beat you
until you fall unconscious. you awake alone in a dungeon cell." what
actually happened can easily be inferred.
 
> >   Mages present an especially problimatic scenario, as
> > they have the option of teleporting beyond the reach of the law...
> 
> Why? If the police employs mages they have the same option. Or they can
> prevent the gate from opening, or from closing behind the mage. There's
> any number of things you can do to solve this I would think?

but then you're being hypocritical and really endangering the suspension
of disbelief. it becomes unreal (in the sense that realism is unto the
game itself) because you've outlawed mages in a city, but here you are
using other mages to keep them out.
 
> > Players escaping by normal means can be tracked, followed, and hunted
> > down.  The only difficulty there is with the following scenario:
> >       >kill Boffo
> >       You place your hands around Boffo's neck and begin to squeeze.
> >       You hear a voice shout 'Hey, unhand that woman!'.
> >       Boffo unsuccessfully attempts to pry your fingers from her thoat.
> >       An armed patrolguard runs in from the West.
> >       >flee west
> >         You release Boffo and run west.
> >       The patrolguard shouts 'I'm gonna get you, Bubba!'.
> >       >quit
> >       connection closed by foriegn host.
> > The solution, of course, is to demand that my players remained connected
> > 24-7..maybe take stats away from them for time spent in RL...(cackle).
> 
> Why not put a criminal on the wanted list if they run off this way. Then
> they must disguise themselves on return or risk being recognised and ar-
> rested next time they connect?

this is somewhat feasible, though of course the guards would already
know that
Bubba is an outlaw, but you have to find some way to get players to risk
their lives to capture him. a high reward works sometimes, but not
always, especially w/ players not interested in money.

> > More realistically, just force _characters_ to remain in-game even while
> > the players are away...It becomes difficult to balance on a PK mud, but
> > managible if you allow players to create scripts and defences to use in
> > place of human input.
> 
> That's a possibility also even though it would make it impossible for
> somebody like me to play your game.

why? seriously you either place your character in a "safe room" where
they cant be attacked (if the game allows such rooms) or you leave your
connection active (their are numerous programs out there that will
reconnect for you if you get dumped) and it is not very hard to program
a simple script that will run when attacked or respond by saying run a
room, hide, when X enters, attack X, run, etc.

> > Mages, (or any other character with access to spatial distortion style
> > magics--i.e. teleport spell), can, instead of quitting in the previous
> > example:
> >       >flee west
> >       You release Boffo and run west.
> >       The patrolguard shouts 'I'm gonna get you, Rasputin!'.
> >       >cast 'blink'
> >       Suddenly, you're standing across the street.
> >       The patrolguard shouts 'Rasputin!  Stand still!'.
> >       >cast 'teleport' home
> >       You stand inside your house.
> >       >enable defence   /* turns 'on' house defences */
> >       Your house is now protected.
> >       A portal begins to open.
> >       There is a flash of light as your house defences close the portal.
> >       You hear many footsteps approaching.
> >       >look outside
> >       You see your carefully manicured lawn.
> >       Many patrolguards stand here.
> >       A patrolguard falls into a pit-trap.
> >       [...many dead patrolguards later...]
> 
> Of course nothing would prevent the patrol guards to send for a mage or
> two to disable your magical defenses.  If the city allows such defenses
> in town in the first place. Or the mage would place a magical dome over
> your house that prevents you from leaving?

again the problem of employing mages being hypocritical.
 
> > The problem here is twofold.  1.)  Magical travel is instanteous and
> > doesn't leave tracks, so its next-to-impossible to catch a mage with a
> > head start.
> 
> This is only true at the moment. Most books which involve magic have it
> leave some kind of residue on the caster that can be tracked by another
> mage. And if the player can portal to another player easily then so can
> the mages of the guard.

see usenet thread.

> >  The guards have to be able to react quick enough to prevent
> > the mage from casting, else the mage can get away.
> 
> This is always true when dealing with a mage.  But it is questionable
> if the magic should be instantaneous.  That is how it works now but I
> guess it would not be that hard to have powerfull or difficult spells
> take time to be casted. Just make them a succession of lesser spells,
> as has been suggested before (I believe with casting fireballs).

it would probably be easier to code a delay based on spellcasting stats
(whatever they may be) vs. the difficulty of the spell. so you cast,
wait X, game checks to make sure you are still unoccupied, cast spell.
 
> > 2.)  If player manages to get their character to its house, it has to
> > be designed to prevent determined PC's from entering (protect PC's from
> > afk PK), so a NPC won't fair all that much better.
> 
> Just hire a better mage?

see above. and on a sidenote, who says there are any mages for hire?
you're assuming this is always true, it could be considered "evil" for a
mage to help other ppl for money, especially if they are similar to a
priest in that they gain their powers by serving their god.
 
> > Basically, I'd have to create a near-omniscient, near-omnipresent, and
> > near-omnipotent police force protecting this anti-violence zone, but such
> > a force would by its nature overrun and control the entire mud-world to
> > impose its doctrine of non-violence everywhere.  While this could be an
> > interesting twist to the mud's theme, its not what I'm looking for.
> 
> I don't understand how you arrive at this conclusion but no doubt I am
> missing something.

if you figure that the guards are able to overcome all of the above
problems, this is a natural conclusion.

-Sauron