[MUD-Dev] BIZ: Who owns my sword?

[ceo]

Crosbie Fitch wrote:
> From: AdamM

> Ok, would it be possible for someone today to sue the makers of
> The Full Monty for depraving and corrupting them?

"The Full Monty" was a product, making the rules quite different.

> Are the producers, directors, cast, and crew, still liable for
> what they've done?

Oh yes, certainly. If someone could build a case for demonstrable
predictable (you aren't normally liable for something you couldn't
have realised might happen) side effects of the film that they
should have been aware of (e.g. under negligence laws). This is not
a country where you aare allowed to do what the heck you like and
damn the consequences.  I rather like it that way - it keeps us from
anarchy.

>>> Sell the content en masse, on a one-shot basis, i.e. a company
>>> dedicated only to produce a particular piece of content. It
>>> disbands the second it gets paid.

>> Ah, so you recommend a game without a game-design (how else is it
>> going to be maintained, fixed, updated, upgraded and improved
>> over time.

> Never said that.

You didn't need to say it explicitly. The fact that you are
describing a situation where there is no-one to maintain it, and to
keep adding to it, implies there is no such design. You said "on a
one-shot basis", not me. Games cannot write themselves. MMOG's do
not magically become artificially intelligent and cleverly make
themselves fun for all to play, adapting themselves to every
exploit, re-balancing the gameplay to suit every change in player
game-styles, adding new content to keep everyone from getting bored.

Although I suspect you will reply "yes, games cannot write
themselves - but the players can write them", I suggest you have a
look at the comments on There etc that came out a while ago on this
list. "player generated content" is no panacea; you cannot ignore
all the problems with that simple phrase. Nor can you claim (unless
you turf up some new research or experience that backs it up) that
it replaces all the problems with a new set that perhaps can be more
easily solved; there is no logic in such a viewpoint...and it
probably means many otherwise fun games become impossible. Not much
of a solution, IMHO. Especially as I suspect the most widely
enjoyable games will remain those with careful ongoing
game-design...anarchy doesn't tend to be all that fun.

>> Those are not synonyms; they are all separate activities that a
>> good MMOG needs).

> I'd say that it would be an even better MMOG that didn't need them.

It wouldn't be a game, in the normal sense. It would be impossible
for the majority of computer-game games to be operated in that
environment.  Obviously, there are some types of game that can work
without rules - since that's part of their core design. It would be
a mistake to believe that all games can operate without rules. I'm
wondering if really you're just envisaging a glorified chat
channel. I'm also wondering if you have ever looked in detail at how
much effort goes into ongoing development of MMOG's just to keep
them treading water...

They are - as Matt rightly pointed out (and indeed as others such as
Gordon Walton have pointed out in the past) - a service. Not a
product.  A service which does not adapt is a dead service. Raph and
others have spoken on this list for years about how amazingly
difficult it is to keep up with the demand for content (of all
forms) - and people have been comparing notes and analyses etc in an
attempt to find new solutions (or prove / disprove existing common
wisdom). I didn't think anyone disagreed that a huge amount of
content must continually be produced?

>> A game with no rules but those the players make from day to day?

> Sounds cool.

> There's room for all sorts of games. Let's not get fixated on the
> 'this is how we do it - ipso facto - this is how it will always be
> done' mindset.

Equally, lets not decide that the game-types that most of us enjoy
(and drive the $40b market) can be conveniently ignored. Sure, I'm
in full agreement that there are several avenues of game that are
woefully under represented these days - but these are not submerged
by what you are proposing - they are mostly impossible in your
proposal.

Adam M
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