[MUD-Dev] Removing the almighty experience point...

[Vincent Archer]

According to brian at thyer.net:

> Instead of fields or dungeons filled with respawning mobs you have
> a mission or a quest that you go on, following step by step the
> quest until you finish.  At the end you're rewarded with a new
> level or something to that degree, right?

Initially, there wasn't any form of quest involved. What the game is
about is mastering tactical problems.

Let's take an example. You're the crowd controller, the guy with the
mesmerize/sleep/polymorph sheep ability. You're with a group of
friends in the middle of a dungeon, when you get caught by a patrol
of mobs. Three guys jump you out of nowhere. Ok, you fire them mez
spells, mez one... mez two... the third is engaged properly.
Killed, the group moves on the second guy. Gets killed. Takes the
final guy.

And suddendly, the little text appear "You have gained an
achievement of level 16". Because you've solved a tactical problem:
keeping two ennemies out of the way during an entire combat (and
surviving the combat without any loss). Depending on the spell stats
and CC effects, it might or might not be an enormous feat. With very
short mezes, it could well be a level 25 achievement. But it shows
you master at least that kind of thing.

The assumption behind this, being, of course, that, after level 16
(or 25), you will routinely have to face sets of 3 ennemies like
that, and it would be good for your playmates to know if you can do
this.

> How is this really different than an experience system?  You go
> out,

I'm surprised so many people are trying to fit this into an xp-point
mold.

The main feature of the system is non-repeatability. You never ever
gain anything anymore by repeating (with the same character) the
exact same things you did earlier. Once you have proved you can do
X, you don't need to prove it again and again and again.

> you kill a bunch of things, you accomplish something (becasue
> killing 150,000 goblins for your next level *is* an
> accomplishment) and you get your level.

Because all you proved is that you can kill mindlessly for X hours.
Good. We now know you can do that.

The next question is: Can you do anything else?

Because if you can kill 150,000 goblins for your next level, then
kill 150,000 greater goblins, and so on, you're doing the same thing
over and over again. You're "treadmilling". And all you prove is
that you can do one thing. You haven't shown any ability to do
anything else.

> So is it grinding?  Certainly, but it's *mission* grinding.  Which
> I

Grinding or treadmilling, the derogatory terms associated with that
are simple: they mean you do one thing. You do the same thing, hour
after hour. You do the same thing at level 5 and at level 30. The
mobs just have different names and stats and maybe skins.

Games aren't supposed to be an endless repeat of the same situation.

> So why get rid of the xp point at all?  Why not leave it in and
> those who want to grind in the more "traditional" sense can, while
> those who want to mission grind can do it that way to?

Because the grind goes counter to my initial design goal. Which is
that the level measure your knowledge and game skill. Not the time
elapsed playing the game.

> Of course this is ignoring what's involved in creating that many
> different unique missions and quests.  Not that I think it can't
> or shouldn't be done.  I'm not any kind of a professional designer
> but I have to imagine there's a good amount of time and money not
> to make mention of the effort involved in creating *so* many
> different missions and quests as well as testing and retesting all
> of them.

Whis is what I said, even if it's not that clearly written:

"The largest problem with that system is, of course, coming up with
achievements."

--
	Vincent Archer			Email:	archer at frmug.org

All men are mortal.  Socrates was mortal.  Therefore, all men are Socrates.
							(Woody Allen)
_______________________________________________
MUD-Dev mailing list
MUD-Dev at kanga.nu
https://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev