[MUD-Dev] Requirements for MM (was Complexities ofMMOGServers)

[Caliban Tiresias Darklock]

From: "Ted L. Chen" <tedlchen at yahoo.com>
> Caliban Tiresias Darklock writes:

>> I would interpret Brian's list as referring not to the number of
>> players that ARE online, but the number that COULD BE online
>> without crowding the environment beyond a reasonable playability
>> threshold. This would mean at the very least:

>>   1. The system will generally accept this many simultaneous
>>   logins,

>>   2. The network performance of each login is generally
>>   acceptable,

>>   3. The game world is not so crowded as to make play difficult
>>   or impossible.

> We could probably diverge on a separate thread (again) about
> whether players in a MOG constitute part of that MOG.  That is:
> "Is an 1000 player capable system with 10 people the same as an
> full 10 player capable system?"  Aside from it sounding like a
> philosophical chinese proverb, the answer can be both yes and no.

That's where question 3 comes in. If having 10 people is crowded,
then it doesn't matter whether your system will accept thousands of
logins -- 10 people can play, anything more is just a traffic
jam. But if there's enough room for thousands of people to play,
then it doesn't matter how many people are *currently* online.

> Personally, I like to include the players as part of the whole MOG
> system.  In their own way, they determine whether a MOG has a
> sense of massiveness, or weight, to it - instead of it being just
> a big empty world.

Footprints are interesting. When a player logs onto a game and can
do something there that affects it, this leaves a sort of footprint
on the world. That footprint makes the world more interesting to
other people, who in turn will leave their own footprints. So while
the players do enhance the MOG, I'd argue that it's their footprints
that enhance it, not the players themselves.

> Actually, by all definitions, VATSIM is a MOG(MUD).

Not the definition where pilots don't directly interact with each
other. If players do not interact, then it is not a multiplayer
game. Consider the following.

Imagine a MAME server. You connect to the site with a proprietary
client, and it has all the MAME ROMs installed on a multiuser
server. Once you connect, you can choose whichever game you like and
play it. The server is constantly packed with thousands of players,
each playing his own game.

That's not a multiplayer game. Even if you cram a chat client into
it, it's not a multiplayer game. There is no component of the
gameplay that is affected by user interaction: your game is your
game, and nobody else is playing it. At best, you could lag someone
with lots of messages. That's about it.

> When I stated that most pilots didn't interact with each other, I
> meant that if Buffy's flying in Britain, she doesn't really care
> that I'm flying over Canada.

By this definition, most players on MMOGs don't interact with each
other, either. When I log onto a game, I tend to interact only with
the same ten or twelve people and maybe another twenty or so who
happen to be in the same vicinity. That's only thirty-odd players
out of the thousands online, many of whom are -- like you and Buffy
-- just operating in far-flung areas (or different servers) where
our actions are largely irrelevant to each other.

>From your more detailed description, it sounds like VATSIM is
something I *would* consider a MMOG, because your statement that
most people don't interact with each other doesn't seem
sensible. Clearly, each pilot *does* interact with other pilots, and
this is a natural and necessary part of the system. I don't
understand why you'd say most of them don't interact, except in the
strictest technical sense that a pilot will not interact with most
other pilots... which is an entirely different thing.

> It's a big world.  Big enough that I'd term it 'M'assive.  And
> going through the same definition, delphiforums can't be
> considered massive much in the same way this list isn't a MMOG.

Ten million registered members and over a million messages a week on
several thousand forums isn't massive? Explain the logic. Did you
even look at the site?

> Of course, I haven't even touched the requirement of real-time
> (not just simultaneous) interaction yet.

You *have* real-time interaction on Delphi. You post, and it's up in
a matter of a few seconds. I've had several discussions there which
involved four or more people simultaneously posting in response to
one another for an extended period of time. (We'll ignore the
availability of chat rooms and instant messaging through the system,
since it's a whole different can of worms. While they are available,
virtually nobody actually uses them, in my experience.)
_______________________________________________
MUD-Dev mailing list
MUD-Dev at kanga.nu
https://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev