[MUD-Dev] Character Restraint & Capture.

Jester jester at futuremmorpg.org
Fri Mar 5 12:00:17 CET 2004

Matt Mihaly wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Feb 2004, Jester wrote:
>>  Matt Mihaly wrote:

>>  I strongly disagree with this as IMHO addressing the in game
>>  justice will address the out of game justice. If a player sees
>>  their killer brought to justice and forced to pay them
>>  reperation then why would they leave the game?

> Because the killer is no more likely to be "brought to justice"
> than the killee is to be "brought to justice." (ie killed via this
> bounty system).

I'm not sure that you've read my design concept
(http://www.futuremmorpg.org/capture.asp) I had listed it in earlier
posts in this thread and as you can see from steps 7 & 8 of my test

Quoted from the web page

  7) Some time later. he finds character K and uses non lethal
  attacks to subdue him.

  8)Whilst in combat he uses his special 'restraining' skill to
  temporarily immobilise character K

The original killer is brought to court in one piece, as bounty
hunters are prohibited from PKing.

> What's stopping a city from making laws that absolutely do not fit
> with any out-of-game sense of justice? How about, "All dwarves are
> evil and must be eliminated on sight." What does that have to do
> with out-of-game justice?

What stops a player from doing anything? The way you structure the
game, the interfaces, commands, or options you give. If there is no
mechanism to set laws according to race then the player can't use
the 'system' to apply them.

> A game system does not know what 'justice' is and it is not
> conceivable that a game system will be able to recognize it
> without sophisticated AI WAY beyond what currently exists even in
> research labs.

I'd rather this didn't turn into a discussion on the definition of
the word 'justice' my system is not a full judicial system it never
has been or was intended to be, the word justice has been used as a
convenient label, but never in a wider context than controlling
PKing. The system's sole use is to help address the sense of
unfairness a player feels when they are killed by another player for
no apparent reason.

>>  This is a very implimentation specific illustration as neither I
>>  in my orginal post or rjw in the followup state the intention to
>>  use 'free' gold I also think that how gameable a system is
>>  depends on the robustness of the underlying concept and the
>>  attention to detail given to the details of the implimentation.

> So write out a design or show me a workable example.

I already have, on the 27th Feb(see the url above) it was evolved
from the original concepts (detailed in earlier posts) in the thread
and after discussing the growing size with the list moderator dumped
onto a web page that I periodically update.

>  I'm just giving > you the benefit of 7+ years of practical,
>  commercial, hands-on > design/admin-side experience.

Something I really truly appreciate, although we may not agree on
some things I do value your input from the 'front line' a great

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