[MUD-Dev] Life

[Adam Wiggins]

[Jamie L:]
> Adam Wiggins writes:
> > This is another thing I have a problem with. People expect their
> > characters to live forever.
> 
> Do they? I don't think you can infer that from the six-year-old
> child example. Being upset at a particular end to a character -
> particularly with no former warning - seems to be a perfectly
> 'reasonable' reaction.

Sorry if this wasn't clear, but I wasn't making that comment in
reference to the 6-year-old, I was making it in comments to some other
things someone (Caliban?) said.  Personally, I find the method of that
characters demise disgusting and the furthest thing I can think of from
'fun', and I hope nothing like that ever happens on my mud.
Being upset at an end to a character is fine, but there's upset as in
you aren't really happy with the way it turned out, and then there's
upset as in you're in severe emotional shock, you complain to the admin,
etc etc.  This is not fun for anyone involved.

> That is, a player may be willing to have their character die, but in
> an appropriate fashion at a time more of their choosing. Or any number
> of other options.

Well, I guess this goes back to the kind of game you want.  What I like
about muds is that they are complete worlds, worlds that carry on
whether I'm there or not - worlds which I may or may not be able to
exert control over.  Things happen in them which are not ideal for my
character, including death.  I don't want to feel completely helpless,
like I'm being swept away in a tide - but neither do I want to feel like
my actions direct 100% of what happens to my character.  I like the
interaction between my character's actions (directed by me) and the
rest of the game world (direted by other players, the builders, the coders,
and so forth).  Death at a time of their choosing, aside from suicide or
self-sacrifice (throwing yourself on the grenade), seems ludicrous to
me.  If I decide where and when I'm going to die, there's never any
feeling of danger or excitement, two things that I want to get out of
a good mud.

> > Lastly, yes I do expect people to just say, 'oh well'.  It's a game.
> > It's a character, a figment of your imagination.
> 
> Yes, and no. Figments of the imagination can be very powerful. I know
> of one deeply IC roleplayer (not a MUDder, to my knowledge) who loses
> part of herself, in a sense, when a character of hers dies - she can't
> go back into that particular mindset, etc. It's all very well to say

This is great - but I don't see how that precludes the character ever
reaching their demise.  All things must end, even good things.  (This
makes the time you have with them that much sweeter, to my mind.)

> "oh well", but that doesn't mean there isn't a problem.

I guess I still don't see where the 'problem' is, exactly.  If you want
to play a game where you know your character can live forever, do so.
If not, why is it a 'problem' when they die?  I'm not saying that you
will necessarily be happy about their demise, or that you won't miss
playing them, etc etc.  I don't consider any of this stuff 'problems'.

> Now, I think this is all basically a matter of game contract. If the
> contract allows for this sort of behaviour, and everyone is informed
> about the contract, then complaining about that fate would be
> pointless - though that doesn't necessarily mean it isn't upsetting to
> the player concerned. I do think, though, that contracts could be made
> more explicit than they are on many MUDs, which would most likely help
> to avoid some of the difficulties that example brings up.

Agreed 100%.  I've posted many times to r.g.m.a on exactly this topic.
It's unfair to expect players to play a game when they don't even
know the basic premise, rules, etc from the outset.

> > You don't cry when you get to the end of a good book, or a good
> > movie, because it doesn't go on any longer
> 
> Speak for yourself.

Heh, I always do.  Guess I should rephrase that as "*I* don't cry because
a good thing is over."  I lament it, particularly if it ended (to my mind)
in an unsatisfying or too-early manner, but I don't write to the author asking
what the hell their problem was, why the ended the book so soon, etc etc ..

> > - you think, 'Wow, that was a great book. Think I'll go buy another
> > one now.'
> 
> Which is not incompatible with the above, please note.

My original point was that people get very upset over something good
being finished, instead of being glad for the experience while it lasted
and then moving on to something new.  I guess the live-forever characters
found on a lot of muds are the equivilent of those series of books
which go on seemingly forever, with the character basically just doing
more of the same in each one - like all those Conan pastiches that continue
to come out.  Really the character was best expressed by RE Howard's
stories in the 20's and 30's, and everything after that has only really
served to cheapen and stereotype an otherwise good character.