[MUD-Dev] MMORPGs & MUDs

[Matt Mihaly]

On Thu, 17 Jan 2002, Michael Tresca wrote:
> Koster, Raph posted on Sunday, January 13, 2002 12:49 AM
 
>> The word "advanced" says again to me that you are applying
>> particular biases. They're just a KIND of gamer, not an advanced
>> level of it.
 
> I disagree.  But then apparently I'm biased. I'll spare us all the
> "You're biased!", "No, you're biased!" accusations. :)

But if you disagree, could you provide some evidence as to why they
are more advanced? I can tell you why Kasparov is a more advanced
chess player than I am. Can you tell me why a roleplayer is a more
advanced game player than a non-roleplayer, without resorting to
subjective value judgements?
 
> Within the context of their game, they most certainly do get more
> advanced.  I do not consider role-playing a separate kind of game,
> not at all.  Role-playing applies to a game that expresses human
> communication -- the closer the game wishes to approximate that,
> the more likely role-playing is a feasible gaming style.  Not a
> kind of gamer, a style.

If human communication is the pinnacle of game playing, then I'd say
that roleplaying is less advanced than people who talk to each other
out of character. They are communicating more relevant information
that way, and being more 'honest' about it.
 
> Regardless, that perception of role-playability as somehow being
> an inherently "better" game is part of what I believe to be a
> natural evolution of exposure to MMORPGs in general.  Players will
> get more and more accustomed to the flashy graphics, to the appeal
> of millions of players, to all those factors that make MMORPGs
> MMORPGs.  Then they start looking for something else.  Maybe that
> explains the popularity of the RP server on DAoC.  I don't know.

How about "better gameplay?" People haven't gotten tired of chess,
because its gameplay is so good.
 
> The MUD approach is the mom and pop store of the game business.
> It doesn't make as much money.  But it works.

I consider it more of a boutique approach. Less customers, but more
money per customer. (WAY less customers).

> > almost every game since has followed suit to one extent or >
> another--in fact, I'd say that the integration of a crafting >
> paradigm into the basic advancement game mechanic is much MORE >
> widespread in MMOs than it is in muds. Similarly, the competitive
> We had crafting before Ultima and several other MUDs that were
> similar to Retro had it before us (BatMUD, DarkeMUD, to name two)

No one is saying you didn't have crafting. He's saying it is far
more widespread in big graphical MUDs than in text MUDs, and on a
percentage basis, he's right. Most of them have it. Most text MUDs
do not.

--matt

_______________________________________________
MUD-Dev mailing list
MUD-Dev at kanga.nu
https://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev